Testy Copy Editors

Our new website is up and running at testycopyeditors.org. This board will be maintained as an archive. Please visit the new site and register. Direct questions to the proprietor, blanp@testycopyeditors.org
It is currently Tue May 14, 2024 6:31 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Mindreading
PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2003 7:22 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2002 1:01 am
Posts: 8342
Location: Bethesda, Md.
Roy Peter Clark, in another of his puzzling pointers at Poynter, likes this opening to a story about people who jump off a bridge:<p> ST. PETERSBURG - The lonely young blond left church on a windy afternoon and drove to the top of the Sunshine Skyway bridge.
Wearing black pumps and a shiny black dress, she climbed onto the ledge and looked at the chilly blue waters 197 feet below. The wind seemed to nudge her. It's time, she thought.
She raised her arms skyward and pushed off the edge. Two boaters watched as she began a swan dive into Tampa Bay.
Halfway down, Dawn Paquin wanted to turn back. "I don't want to die," she thought.
A second later, she slammed into the water. It swallowed her, and then let her go. She broke through the surface, screaming.
<p>***There's a lot more wrong with that than the mindreading, but that alone was enough for someone to have said: "No. Try again."***<p>[ October 27, 2003: Message edited by: blanp ]</p>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 2:29 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2003 12:01 am
Posts: 63
Location: Chicago
It's not mindreading if the plunging Miss Paquin survived her splash and then later told a reporter that halfway down she thought, "I don't want to die." She may not have actually thought such a thing at the time, but if she says she did, it's fair material for a reporter. It's not mindreading, it's ... mind-quoting.<p>[ October 28, 2003: Message edited by: ShiningPath ]</p>


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 3:56 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2002 1:01 am
Posts: 8342
Location: Bethesda, Md.
We cannot say what someone thought. We can report what someone said they thought. If that spoils the five-paragraph "narrative," too bad.<p>[ October 28, 2003: Message edited by: blanp ]</p>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 4:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2002 1:01 am
Posts: 8342
Location: Bethesda, Md.
An aside:
The story says:<p> She said she flapped her arms like a chicken and righted herself, ensuring that her feet hit the water first. <p>***A question for our science adviser: Is that even possible?***<p>[ October 28, 2003: Message edited by: blanp ]</p>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 6:43 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 1:01 am
Posts: 113
Location: Suburban Chicago
<blockquote><font size="1" face="TImes, TimesNR, serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by blanp:
We cannot say what someone thought. <p><hr></blockquote><p>I disagree, as you know.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 11:35 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2002 12:01 am
Posts: 744
Location: HuskerLand
And, just to remind folks, blonds refer to men and blondes refer to women. So, if the diver was female, than the opening line is incorrect.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 11:46 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Apr 18, 2002 12:01 am
Posts: 1399
Location: In the newsroom
<blockquote><font size="1" face="TImes, TimesNR, serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by majorbabs:
And, just to remind folks, blonds refer to men and blondes refer to women. So, if the diver was female, than the opening line is incorrect.<hr></blockquote> Not by our stylebook (and no doubt others). It's another distinction that has gone by the wayside.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 1:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2002 12:01 am
Posts: 887
Location: U.S.A.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="TImes, TimesNR, serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by SusanV:
Not by our stylebook (and no doubt others). It's another distinction that has gone by the wayside.<hr></blockquote><p>But not according to the stylebook most of us use. :><p>Not that I wouldn't mind seeing "blonde" disappear from the AP Stylebook. I personally fail to see the point of saying we must refer to a female as a "blonde" when "blond" refers to both genders, at least according to Webster's.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 2:47 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2002 1:01 am
Posts: 8342
Location: Bethesda, Md.
Blond or blonde, it's not an appropriate first reference except maybe to a "beauty pageant" contestant or a character in a badly written detective novel.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2003 10:15 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 12:01 am
Posts: 3137
Location: Homebush NSW Australia
<blockquote><font size="1" face="TImes, TimesNR, serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by blanp:
Blond or blonde, it's not an appropriate first reference except maybe to a "beauty pageant" contestant or a character in a badly written detective novel.<hr></blockquote> Quite right. A matter that should be included in every style book but sadly isn't.<p>[ October 28, 2003: Message edited by: Paul Wiggins ]</p>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2003 12:02 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2002 12:01 am
Posts: 744
Location: HuskerLand
Yet another logical reason to occasionally vary from the AP Stylebook.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:17 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2002 12:01 am
Posts: 131
Location: Cleveland, OH
Give Clark his due; he's making a point about building up drama in a story, letting it go -- presumably to get at the details of how we know what the woman was thinking -- and building it up again. I don't know about you, I read lots of 60-inchers that are mind-numbing. <p>I'm not sure how one would justify insisting that "blond" in the only spelling and still permit a writer to describe someone solely as a "blond(e)". Maybe describing the jumper in one word was more important than pissing people off. I'm not sure the decision was the right one, though.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:38 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 12:01 am
Posts: 3137
Location: Homebush NSW Australia
On the subject of reporting suicide http://www.mindframe-media.info/ offers substantial food for thought.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:41 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2002 1:01 am
Posts: 8342
Location: Bethesda, Md.
Another of the many problems with the faux narrative approach is that the story isn't "about" the woman, it's about the bridge.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mindreading
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:03 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2003 12:01 am
Posts: 63
Location: Chicago
<blockquote><font size="1" face="TImes, TimesNR, serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by blanp:
Another of the many problems with the faux narrative approach is that the story isn't "about" the woman, it's about the bridge.<hr></blockquote><p>Yes, but the bridge declined to be interviewed.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group

What They're Saying




Useful Links